Thread: Thrasha's Journey

Originally Posted by Shrek

How can it be a strength routine when I never max out with one reppers?
Of course you can squat 3 times per week with intensity, as long as you have adequate rest and nutrition.

The benefits of this routine is systemic all over body growth, I don't have to wait a whole week before training each body part and it's fun.

Thrasher - It will only build a thicker body if your diet is fucked. That comments astounds me. It's not a strength program. I have no desire to squat 250kg, I want massive legs.

I kinda have to disagree with you there man, but I don't wanna start an argument, to each their own, and I respect that.

But what I'm saying is with my intensity there is no way I can squat 3 times per week. And I dont do low reps either. I maxed out the other day on squats at 200kg for 6 reps. The went to 1 plate and did 30 reps, or was it 20? But anyway, I've done heavy, I've done light and both ways made me so sore I needed atleast a week to recover. And to be honest, doing light weights with giant sets on legs made me walk funny for weeks.

My rest and recovery are also pretty good, even on gear. I ate heaps of clean food, plenty of sleep and I was still sore for days on end. The only body parts I could even contemplate training twice per week is arms and shoulders cause they recover alot quicker.

I agree. I can only train quads once a week due to soreness. I trained them on Friday and I'm still sore today.

Originally Posted by RF1964

I agree. I can only train quads once a week due to soreness. I trained them on Friday and I'm still sore today.

The more you train them though - the more conditioning you will get in them, so less muscle soreness after training. Just my opinion, and has worked in practice for me.

Everyone is arguing intensity which is fine because it is important. I think what is being debated is volume. Sure you can do one legs day per week and do the same amount of volume AND intensity as 3 times per week.

Shreks program has around 10-12 sets, at 4-7 reps for the week (split across 3 sessions). So totals between 40 and 84 squats per week. Lets settle in between and say 60 squats total.

Could it then be said for the once a week squatters - you are also doing around the 60 squat mark in one session? IW2BC - you mention doing 200kg for 6 reps, then light weight for 30. So thats only two sets and you have already done 36 squats in that one session - and I'll assume you did more.

I'll go even further and suggest Shrek could possibly be getting more intensity from his sessions. Sure he is doing them more often - but the volume in EACH SESSION is less and *may* mean he can push harder, more intensity - and by the end of the week he has reached the same volume as the once a week squatter. In fact probably more.

So more intensity and more volume in Shreks program?

I may have done a terrible job of explaining all that! ha ha

I understand what your saying but this debate has been going on for years. There are plenty of articles that would suggest that you train (your legs for example) just short of failure (1-3 reps) and therefore allowing you to train them more often. Then you have the second school of thought HIT. You train to failure and beyond and then allow sufficient time for the muscle to recover. I'm of the second school. I personally smash my legs. Leg extensions to warm the joints then straight into front squats, leg press, single leg press and ending with leg extensions again and that's just quads. By the time I'm finished I can barely walk up or down stairs without holding onto the railing.

So which is better? That I think depends on the individual. As long as you're seeing growth that's all that matters.

less soreness because you've adapted to the smaller workout. squats squats and more squats? isnt it good to change it up?

i dont know if its better to say for example do squats 3 times a week (where you are only doing squats) Vs Giving them 1 day to squat leg press hack, curl, lunge whatever.
To me squating so much is like you're going over the same thing over and over not really hitting the legs from different angles to smash the whole leg.

it is a good debate however. what is better? obviously 1 who trains 1 way will say theirs is better and give their reasons. benefits to both but in the end which is better?

Originally Posted by determined

IW2BC - you mention doing 200kg for 6 reps, then light weight for 30. So thats only two sets and you have already done 36 squats in that one session - and I'll assume you did more.

Yeah man, I maxed out at 200kg for 6 reps, thats not the only set I did.

Lets look at it from another angle. Bodybuilders predominantly train bodyparts once, maybe twice per week on lagging bodyparts. But they train all bodyparts on seperate days (with exception of say triceps, biceps, calves for example). Powerlifters train the big 3, multiple times per week. Some don't even train the smaller/supporting muscles at all. What do the they train for?

It all depends on your goals as to how you train.

definition comes with diet.

Originally Posted by IW2BC

Yeah man, I maxed out at 200kg for 6 reps, thats not the only set I did.

Lets look at it from another angle. Bodybuilders predominantly train bodyparts once, maybe twice per week on lagging bodyparts. But they train all bodyparts on seperate days (with exception of say triceps, biceps, calves for example). Powerlifters train the big 3, multiple times per week. Some don't even train the smaller/supporting muscles at all. What do the they train for?

It all depends on your goals as to how you train.

What youve said is the same reason i thought it was a powerlifting/strength program...

Yes to a certain extent, You must remember I am not doing 20 sets per bodypart. I am doing around 5, so i am able to go hard for 5 sets. If i was maxing out on !RM's then I would agree on the powerlifting / strength training principle.

Originally Posted by Shrek

Yes to a certain extent, You must remember I am not doing 20 sets per bodypart. I am doing around 5, so i am able to go hard for 5 sets. If i was maxing out on !RM's then I would agree on the powerlifting / strength training principle.

maybe its something i need to see and do before i understand... Im open to different things.

i might add i did legs yesterday and today im limping around lol. hurts to flex em hahaha

Originally Posted by Shrek

Yes to a certain extent, You must remember I am not doing 20 sets per bodypart. I am doing around 5, so i am able to go hard for 5 sets. If i was maxing out on !RM's then I would agree on the powerlifting / strength training principle.

Thats true, and I trust and believe that what you're doing is good for you, I'm not bagging it at all. I guess I am just trying to get my head around the principles in which you follow. For example if I were to do 5 sets per bodypart I'd definitely leave the gym feeling like I've cheated myself out of a good workout. I'd never be able to get enough blood in my muscle to tear the fibres and help it grow bigger. And it was a good point made about the amount of sets over a week period, but even still as I said it wouldn't be get enough blood in my muscle over the week.

I'd seriously love to know how much you've grown from this program, cause its intriguing me...

Its been (and still is) a good discussion and its been great different views can all be expressed without people being flamed. Good stuff.

Originally Posted by Thrasha

maybe its something i need to see and do before i understand... Im open to different things.

i might add i did legs yesterday and today im limping around lol. hurts to flex em hahaha

Probably because you did numerous sets. Afte time though you won't feel sore and you will be able to train legs or any body part 3 times per week.

Originally Posted by IW2BC

Thats true, and I trust and believe that what you're doing is good for you, I'm not bagging it at all. I guess I am just trying to get my head around the principles in which you follow. For example if I were to do 5 sets per bodypart I'd definitely leave the gym feeling like I've cheated myself out of a good workout. I'd never be able to get enough blood in my muscle to tear the fibres and help it grow bigger. And it was a good point made about the amount of sets over a week period, but even still as I said it wouldn't be get enough blood in my muscle over the week.

I'd seriously love to know how much you've grown from this program, cause its intriguing me...

You feel cheated because you have been seen many BB train this way and you feel if you do less I will have less growth. Not true, you may do less in that workout but you will train that bodypart again in 2 days so in the end you will probably do more.
I know it may be difficult for you to grasp because I was like you and only did specific bodyparts for years. Believe me after doing this style of training you won't like split bodypart routines again.
I might add that if you are in pre-comp training especially a few weeks out, this style of training may not suit as you recovery will be diminished due to calorie restrictions, then split bodypart routines may be of an advantage.

Also, how boring is it doing legs for 1 hour or so, better to go hard for 15-20 mins and then do some benches followed by some rows etc etc? Makes training much more fun. Also you can really do whatever rep range you like, I choose minimum of 4 and maximum of 7. You may like 8 or 10, it matters not, what matters is the effort you put in, the intensity.

Cheers.

Originally Posted by Shrek

You feel cheated because you have been seen many BB train this way and you feel if you do less I will have less growth.

Nah I meant cause I dont feel it in the muscle enough over the period of my training for that day, I dont feel the muscle has been worked to the extent it needs to.

But you are not waiting a week to train it again, you are only waiting 2 days.

Perform 2-3 warm-ups and 4-5 working sets, 3 times per week. that's 15 working sets done at optimal performance, after 4-5 sets of flat bench your incline bench will not be performed at optimal performance, then I bet you do flyes, pec dec, and God know how many other exercises.......How can they be performed at optimimum when you chest is fried. My chest size and strength has gone through the roof training this way. I really struggled with 5 reps at 100kg now I can do 120 for 5 probably more if I had a spotter.

Shrek, you can photos that you would like to post?? I'm serious, I'm not trying to be sarcastic or condescending. I can see some merit in what you're saying but like IW2BC, I don't feel that I have worked the muscle unless I work it with 20+ sets (depending on the muscle group of course and also I follow Rambod's FST-7 protocol).

You see the problem I have with your method is that I don't think that I would get sufficient intensity from that type of routine. To use an analogy, let's look at tearing the muscle down so it can be rebuilt stronger as a cut that you get on your leg for example. If you pick at the scab before it's properly healed it will never get better. That's how I look at your method. I would be working the muscle before it had time to heal so it couldn't grow back stronger. Of course speaking only for myself, my age would also have a lot to do with it. I don't know how old you are but you probably recover better than I do.

Again it's in your mind. The main thing is progression, lift more wieght each workout or perform more reps. Also remember you are working the, muscle 3 times per week not once.


One point I will make. Once the muscle is torn how many more times can you tear it?

Perform the minimal amount to tear it, then tear it again 2 days later, not 5,6 or 7 days later.

Originally Posted by Shrek

Again it's in your mind. The main thing is progression, lift more wieght each workout or perform more reps. Also remember you are working the, muscle 3 times per week not once.


One point I will make. Once the muscle is torn how many more times can you tear it?

Perform the minimal amount to tear it, then tear it again 2 days later, not 5,6 or 7 days later.

Your routine isn't the same as Layne Nortons by any chance is it?

I have no idea what Layne does.
The only thin he and I have in common is we are both natural, well he reckon's he is.